machine or almost machine

[hipro25]

Hello.

a sheet metal processing company has commissioned us a cutting group to be inserted in an automatic system already in place.

Basically it is a couple of presses operated by a pneu-hydraulic actuator that moves a punch and practice of the sunshades on steel sheets sp=2mm.

the press has been supplied without electric part and without protection organs as it will be operated by the plc existing in the plant and will be inserted in an existing fence.

the press is besieged by a manipulator who loads and discharges the plates to be cut off.

In view of the nature of the system, provided without electric drive, controlled by an existing electrical framework, unable to use stand alone, I framed it as an almost machine in the machine directive.

What do you think I have to certify it as a car or almost a car?

Thank you very much

 

[gerod]

the car certifies, the qm no!

Since your object has a well defined application, it is machine for me.

 

[hipro25]

the car certifies, the qm no!

Since your object has a well defined application, it is machine for me.

The declaration of incorporation is made for the almost machine according to the annex to the machinery directive.

the problem that I see to certify it as a machine is that there is no electric part I can not describe the principles of operation, at least they could use it stand alone without any kind you shelter or security system.

alone could not work, both x lack of q.e. and for security.

 

[gerod]

no, the incorporation statement is not there. the label implies compliance with a directive, qm is not a machine and therefore cannot be trusted!

a tape without "drive system" or "control system" is a machine. if I put it in the middle of a factory without any connection, it does not work but it is still a machine.
if the machine is without protection and safety systems remains a machine, it is a statement that is present in the guidelines!

on this subject I wrote an article (April 2013) after analyzing the guidelines of the directive.. .
Hi.

 

[Pastorman75]

Hello everyone, I remember that the almost machines had been introduced to unpack the vans that bought finished machines but without electric motor and circulated them as pieces of iron not being able to be defined real machines without the electric or pneumatic drive that it is.
If the object in question does not work in any way without an electrical actuator being added, I would call it "almost machine".
Gerod seems very safe and I'll check for scruples. greetings

 

[gerod]

Actually the difference is not that it does not work, it is that it does not have a well defined application.
The thing is substantial.
the problem is to define what is the well-defined application.

However, mine is an assessment of how much I read and studied.

 

[Pastorman75]

I agree with gerod. It's a car. I have read some interpretations and the fact of having a specific and definitely very specific application determines that it is a machine regardless of whether it does not work.
thanks to gerod for making me doubt my little certainties... ..just collapsed!
with affection, greetings

 

[gerod]

:tongue:
Thank you!
a greeting

 

[hipro25]

Good morning, gentlemen.

by rereading and comparing me to the right and missing, I have come to the same conclusions.

It is a machine and for the certification I will describe the principle of operation even without electric part and protections, carrying out risk assessment and describing what are the safety measures to be taken in case the machine is set up.

Moreover according to the customer, we will order the certification of the whole plant (the machine we provide + the manipulator + the robots that weld) which makes me feel more quiet because I will ensure that all the system will meet the minimum safety requirements.

thank you very much for the collaboration and good work

♪