the new university order

[ingmex]

I often read on the internet about the new order, and of course the opinions are far from positive. But no one ever speaks of the new order, that of the dm 270/04. because things have changed a lot, but almost nobody seems to have noticed it. I wanted your opinion on these news that second have improved a little the damage done by no! the new reform in fact previews a number of examinations much less, 20 to the triennial, and 12 to the specialist, therefore much more voluminous as examinations. Moreover a path is previewed to y, therefore a three-year self-conclusive path, with final thesis and internship, flanked for only two years with a direct path of 5 years, i.e. with a three-year without thesis, internship etc.., therefore a third normal academic year!my idea is that in practice it has returned, establishing two paths, a little like vo and university degree. I would have preferred vo anyway, but at least some problems were solved. What do you think?
bye:

 

[PierArg]

I often read on the internet about the new order, and of course the opinions are far from positive. But no one ever speaks of the new order, that of the dm 270/04. because things have changed a lot, but almost nobody seems to have noticed it. I wanted your opinion on these news that second have improved a little the damage done by no! the new reform in fact previews a number of examinations much less, 20 to the triennial, and 12 to the specialist, therefore much more voluminous as examinations. Moreover a path is previewed to y, therefore a three-year self-conclusive path, with final thesis and internship, flanked for only two years with a direct path of 5 years, i.e. with a three-year without thesis, internship etc.., therefore a third normal academic year!my idea is that in practice it has returned, establishing two paths, a little like vo and university degree. I would have preferred vo anyway, but at least some problems were solved. What do you think?
bye:

Hi, I heard about it.

I remember that already at my last year of university (2008) the various institutions were organizing for the brand new order.
I think it was done with the intention to fill the remarkable gaps of the no (the one from which I came out)... to see the results, in my opinion, we have to wait a few more years.

with regard to the no the great mistake was to give less hours for each single matter and insert so many additional contour materials with the sole purpose of dividing the courses between the professors (the classic eat).
In fact the total hours were always those, only that were divided by materials of which n/2 were completely useless.

in my opinion it remains that if a person is "pleasant" still manages to cope in every situation. For example I recommend studying on the books and notes of the old order so as to have the complete picture in every discipline.

 

[ingmex]

are very welcome on the value of individual people, there are people who want a great preparation, and they get it regardless of order. the problem was the many people who, in order to have a title, studied only the strict need that they could not do with the vo. with the nno you are going back to this level, at this point depends a lot on the university, to the polimi the reform has been applied well, we will see the results in a few years.

 

[Fulvio Romano]

who comes out of the brand new to which sections of the albo can enroll (engineering word)?

but then the victims of the short bracket of the no can sue the gelmini?

However most of the preparation actually does the student. Of course, studying in chaos is unnecessarily more difficult, regardless of the student's will.

 

[PierArg]

...the problem was the many people who, in order to have a title, studied only the strict need that they could not do with the vo... .

the problem in reality were also the professors themselves to feed this vicious circle (I admit they were forced). You know how they were thinking?
as (see my previous comment) the hours were reduced, the professors could never finish the program. then they said so:
"who wants to take the maximum of votes must finish the program alone. who instead settles for unfulfilled votes, can bring only the program that we have done to lesson!"

Obviously many of them were also available at reception in case of questions about topics not dealt with in lesson.


Do you want to know the percentage of people who finished the whole program?
at most 3%


I open a bracket. I think not only had negative aspects... had a positive one. given the huge amount of exams, the first year you found yourself an outburst of prophesicity. ..maybe you had to go to the first 2 exams and you were stuck a whole year (if obviously you weren't busy).
Do you know how many retreats were after the first year? a myriad

 

[Fulvio Romano]

Do you want to know the percentage of people who finished the whole program?
at most 3%


I open a bracket. I think not only had negative aspects... had a positive one. given the huge amount of exams, the first year you found yourself an outburst of prophesicity. ..maybe you had to go to the first 2 exams and you were stuck a whole year (if obviously you weren't busy).
Do you know how many retreats were after the first year? a myriad

natural selection therefore...:finger:

 

[ingmex]

who comes out of the brand new to which sections of the albo can enroll (engineering word)?

but then the victims of the short bracket of the no can sue the gelmini?

However most of the preparation actually does the student. Of course, studying in chaos is unnecessarily more difficult, regardless of the student's will.

These have remained unchanged, there are always three sections, but allow me to say that it is not wrong. there are limit cases, but to allow for example ing.informatics to design houses or plants does not make sense, as it is not its field of study.imho

In any case, it would be necessary to ask berlinguer, even if I understood the reference.

In fact the great value of having exams so is to have more time, as you have a semester with 3-4 exams, and the semester after another 3 exams, all more full, but better organized. In addition, here to the polimi, but I believe everywhere the access to the propedeutic path is reserved for those with average >=24 and has 90% of the exams in the second year.

 

[PierArg]

... access to the propedeutic path is reserved for those with an average of >=24 and has 90% of the exams in the second year.

What does access to the propedeutic path mean?
Shouldn't it be mandatory with everyone?
If you have the exams continue, otherwise you can recover them because you can't take the others. Right?


@fulvio: it was a selection as ruthless as right...after the first year at least 40% retreated. after the second he retired another good 20%: were those who after 2 years had not yet finished most of the first year's stones.

 

[ingmex]

no it is not for everyone, the path is to y, who does not have the media and exams is obliged to conclude the triennial, if then he wants to enroll to the master must recover of the exams and do a selection examination, moreover if the average is too low is prevented access.

 

[PierArg]

no it is not for everyone, the path is to y, who does not have the media and exams is obliged to conclude the triennial, if then he wants to enroll to the master must recover of the exams and do a selection examination, moreover if the average is too low is prevented access.

Ahhhhhh... now I understand. The same thing was with no. I believe that this speech is at the discretion of the university.
where I was, for example, working with the final graduation vote (and then also came into play the thesis score that facilitated you):
- final vote <83 you were at home...that maybe it was better. if with 5/6 extra bonus points on the thesis you could not tear a 83 then the situation was quite tragic.
- from 83 to 95 you had to do the admission test (examino+orale)
- over 95 right to the master.


Do you know what was the serious factor that sputt@n@to all the speech? that for a strange coincidence of the case, every year, always by coincidence, the number of places of the magisterium was in excess and therefore also the first band (<83) could make the esamino (which I add was a total farce with the traces that already circulated days before).

Unfortunately I have never seen a person who with this mechanism was made out.

by now university is a business, more enrolled=more money

 

[tortellino]

Do you want to know the percentage of people who finished the whole program?
at most 3%

'na generation of scientists, I think I understand!!!! :biggrin:

 

[luigi.paiano]

ip graduated from three-years with old 509 after 33 exams(!!) and now at master 270.you want my opinion? much better before, now the preparation is much cheaper.

 

[Ste_d]

I am of the new (not brand new) but in my case the course of studies has clearly improved compared to 509. But it's even harder!

 

[Ing Italy]

I am of the new (not brand new) but in my case the course of studies has clearly improved compared to 509. But it's even harder!

I honestly can't say if it's better now or earlier because I don't know the system before the new order.
Since you think otherwise or still have a different experience from the people I've always heard about this topic, I'd like to better understand your point of view, if you have time, can you explain it a little?

 

[Ste_d]

I honestly can't say if it's better now or earlier because I don't know the system before the new order.
Since you think otherwise or still have a different experience from the people I've always heard about this topic, I'd like to better understand your point of view, if you have time, can you explain it a little?

Hey!
Look at you I'll explain it with pleasure, I have several friends of 509 who just graduated... of course everything is related to my specific case of the athenaeus Pisa and to the cdl in ing.meccanica order 270.
The most important thing is that they have introduced prophesiivity, examinations cannot be proved unless they have exceeded prophesitic ones. some are to be reviewed as absurd (they are discussing it) but all submerged are just, for example to give construction elements of the machines you must have passed construction technique, applied mechanics and mechanical technology. in the past a lot of students arrived at the bottom of the course without giving physics or drawing of the first year.
have revisited the various courses both as credits and as a program of studies, for example before there was a single examination of general physics from 12 cfu while now there is one from 12cfu of physics 1 and one from 6cfu of physics 2. idem with mathematical analysis... In short, they are courses of a different substance than before. a maximum roof of 4 tests has been introduced for each exam in an academic year, if you take it more than 4 times (on 7 appeals available) you must wait the following year to try again. this was done to make sure that people face the exam to pass it and not to try the fate or hope in the cask!
have also retired prehistoric teachers to introduce more young and competent teachers especially in certain courses that were previously considered mattresses.
As for the degree now it is from 3cfu while before it was from 6cfu, in fact it was necessary to do a longer job that took away a lot of time. now everything is resolved in less than a month with a presentation of 10 minutes maximum in private form, the ceremony is only to announce the vote (which you already know). so much the majority of students continue with the specialist, useless to waste time doing a job for the three-year degree.

for this I say that it is more difficult, but in my opinion it is a much more complete course and with the propedeucities it obliges you to go step by step; the reverse of the medal is that if you can't pass a certain exam (as in my case) you just find yourself a year back since you can't give others.

they have also modified the specialist but on this I cannot say anything because I am still at the three-year (last year) but my friends are very well.

as regards the "who wants to take the maximum of votes must finish the program alone. who instead settles for votes not full, can bring only the program that we have done in lesson!" from me never existed! professors have always explained everything at the cost of doing recoveries on Saturday morning. I know for certain that in some cdl type ing.edile oral examinations are "Do you want the question to confirm or try to raise the vote? " in my course they don't tell you anything, indeed at the orale you'll be happy to meet 29 (see more than once) :biggrin: