doubts about internships and poststage.

[Cornetto]

Good morning, everyone.
This is my first message here in the forum (I signed up a moment ago :d) and I hope I have cleared the section.

I give you a little personal background and then I go to expose my problem : I am 23 years old (24 April 7th o_o) , I graduated in scientific high school and I attended the university for 3 years (unfinished , I interrupted in 2017 at the 3rd year for a psychological tracollo)
, I was a firm year (the worst period of my life, I felt a [Bleep] for interrupting my studies, I was always depressed and my parents pressed to find a job ) but I resumed a little bit and since November of last year I started a 600-hour mechanical designers/projectors course funded by industry with a 240-hour internship.
for the internship they sent me to a company that produces lawnmower cartridges by molding; they needed a designer in the technical office who took care of the creation of the model and to perform tests on it.
I started the internship with this company on 25 March and since the first day this problem has arisen: I am the only one who deals with design throughout the company.
I am the only person in this "technical office", every day I spend 8 hours alone in this room (except for sporadic visits of the owner who passes to give me guidelines on the project and other useful info) , no other employee knows how to carry out this job and therefore I found myself alone in this room to use a software that I did not know and of which I can not find dispenses or video aids online (true visi) that only a tussetor
However, being the only one in the whole company to know how to do this kind of work, post-stage recruitment would be practically guaranteed.

It is here that I am in conflict: on the one hand, after the period of internship, I would like to go to look for other companies willing to educate me as you must (I have already found 2-3 who are looking for profiles in line with my and who offer internships) but on the other hand I would go to lose the security of the fixed place and also the trust of my parents who want to get a job as soon as possible.

This is what... sorry for my papyrus but I couldn't synthesize more than that.
thank you in advance for those who will answer:

 

[MassiVonWeizen]

What you're doing is not an internship, you need to talk about it and realize the institution that's training you. that if it had a common sense, it would do some checks of the company in which it sends you and also verify that it has a software inherent to the course (maybe that there are no greater contributions from the European community is also due to these courses made to the living the parish priest)

already a person who at 23 years old, with little knowledge of mechanics, technical design and studies of construction science (which university you have forgotten to say) is put to make design shatter the absurd; then lawnmower, not the palette to turn the pizza... If you're wrong, pull your legs to people. .

you should be the first to say that this job is not suitable and not even useful to your person for many reasons, including emotional and psychological.

solidworks has a well-made internal tutorial and many others are on the net.

If you have places where you're taken to do internships, why are you eating your liver? only for the fixed place? Don't believe it is, if they want to send you home anyway or they put you in the condition of leaving yourself. even putting the place really safe as you think it will be your life if you start the day with the wizard and return home with the double wizard for the next 5, 10, 40 years?

 

[Cornetto]

you forgot to say that

You're right.
cmq construction engineering interrupted to the 3rd year with about 5-6 exams left back then on the technical drawing side are not so unprepared as perhaps transpaved from the post.

solidworks has a well-made internal tutorial and many others are on the net.

solidworks in fact was one of the programs that we used within this course and I would not have had all the problems I am having now with faces.

If it made sense, it would do some checks of the company in which it sends you and also verifying that it has software inherent to the course (maybe that there are no greater contributions from the European community is also due to these courses made to the living the parish priest)

Let's forget it, the organization of this course has been horrible since the first days.
I and my comrades have always complained, but nothing has ever changed, but now it seems useless to me to complain if I know that I will not be heard.

 

[MassiVonWeizen]

If you don't give yourself a move, no one else will do it for you.
the essential things you have to do are:
clarify the situation with the institute
clarify the situation with owner

Optional:
Take that away designer/designer from the profile because at the moment you are neither

 

[ale47p]

If you don't give yourself a move, no one else will do it for you.

holy words

Don't throw yourself down. I know it's hard in days, but there's always a way out.
straighten the antennas, you're looking

 

[MassiVonWeizen]

Building engineering with lawnmowers has little, very little, but also nothing.
as you can throw yourself out of the blue to do something that has little relevance to your studies for me remains a mystery. I do not judge you, it is my reflection.
You're good at taking classes rather than being home to curse the government. better try to open up as many doors as possible, but I was perhaps a course of architecture or geometra would have seemed to me a more logical iter.
I did a course similar to your where you did so much cad, computer science, cam, but technical design and really little design.
there are technical solutions that do not learn from the texts, but because you have acquired a mechanical logical process: how to make a welding sequence, how to make a bevel, what is the process to sew a forced coupling. . .
I don't want to stand against you, but be realistic and make you aware that the path you chose is definitely steep

 

[MoldMaker]

Hey, can I ask you what area are you? Also from me in the company started a new intern (I think it did your own course), however not to throw you down, but the fixed place according to me does not guarantee you anyone, in the sense... if this company has never had a technical office why start with you??? (no offense of course, but from what you said, you have the basics of mechanics) I would ask this question to me.. you are young and sure if you have desire and passion you can learn any craft, my advice and really seek someone who can teach you the job (but don't think about finding a person who follows you 8/8 hours a day because in the work reality it would be a waste of resources and money not indifferent, you must be able to extrapolate everything that can teach you and do it yours up to the last drop) also as they have already advised you look for a job that you really like to get up the morning. .

 

[exxon]

internships at my time were not there, as there was no erasmus and other "innovations" like... Internet. at 19 years, just enrolled at the university after technical maturity, I started working in a company in my area. The deal was: you come here, you work, you learn, and in return you don't take anything. I agreed. five years later I was dt of that company, and I was 11 years old.

Today it seems a acquired right that anyone should be hired and put "in training" with the same salary of an equal operating level. "I've been hired, but no one has taught me the job. ah, and I only pay 1200 euros a month."

I will be old, I will be antisocial, but to me that someone claims to be paid to learn, it seems like a great... nonsense.

 

[MassiVonWeizen]

here exxon exaggerates according to me.
I also did the internships for free and only for the benevolence of the owner was compensated for something that was just enough to make an evening with friends.
and I also think that it is not a duty to be paid to do the internship that in fact replaces the school where you are not paid and you must not expect to be productive to the company that hosts you, indeed you are a raft.
However, this does not mean that you should not receive training for which you are being hosted. if it is all true what it says and not an excess of vittimism, to be put alone in an office to do things that you do not know to do, with sporadic visits of the owner is not to be formed, but to be used by soprammobili.
certainly the move must start from the user who, as said, must speak with the responsible and then instead of waiting for the descent of the holy spirit through twitter, get off in the workshop and its ideal pedestal, go to the assembly department and look at his tutor that even if it is

only one worker responsible for assembly

(Now that I read this sentence, I'd get rid of a... but how do you write such a thing, that if you should pay coffee every day and thank for what you can teach you) he teaches more practical technique than a university... and maybe even put on a pair of gloves and help.

 

[welcome to the machine]

"that someone claims to be paid to learn, it seems a great... foolishness. "
It's a thorny argument, but I think what makes the difference is "pretend."

 

[Stan9411]

always depends on the background situation @exxon ... you said you started working in a company in your area: means having the constant physical support of the family and its ease in the movements.
I have always had to rely on my parents in the years of college for big expenses ( rent, bills, college fees...), while the evening with the girl I financed it giving repetitions once in a while. clearly to 24 years, with so many sacrifices made this situation begins to weigh. when I arrived at the pre-thesis internship, I was lucky enough to find leaders who listened to my situation, they saw my resume and were well pleased to train and pay me (just hundreds of euros). I followed my manager in the various business activities in the morning and after lunch I put myself at my desk to deal with a job, for which their technicians had little time and that I earned myself as a thesis.

with this I want to say that your idea cannot be generalized (“the young man at first must learn therefore cannot complain if they do not pay him”), because it depends on how much situations allow the young man to “survive” in this situation.

and I at this point must say fortunately there are people who do not think like you and look at what is behind a poor neolaureate

 

[+forte]

internships are a smart way used by the majority of Italian entrepreneurs to make someone work without paying it

 

[exxon]

@stan9411 companies are not charitable bodies or a propagement of the school system that should use resources to satisfy or assist the formation of students. an intern is always a cost for the company and in most cases will not enter the organic, becoming a waste of resources.

the only way in which the company can return costs and consider them an investment, is in case the intern is hired and remains in the company for a sufficiently long period. if the same student immediately demonstrates that he is not suitable or interested in the environment in which he was inserted, he is not surprised to be neglected.

In other cases, as the op appears, it is the company that is not structured to offer what the intern perhaps expects, and this "abandonment" is consequently. It is not surprising that these are the companies, those in which it is most likely to be recruited at the end of the internship.

My personal example I didn't report it as a vant, but as an example of what the situation was like 40 years ago. Mine was not an isolated case, it was so for everyone. the workers had the apprenticeship, for the others there was this type of tire. I don't complain about it. If I go back, I'd do exactly the same thing. By pulling the famous line, at the end that company gave me everything I had to do.

It would be better if things hadn't changed: internships and "school-work alternation" did not bring anything good, first of all to the direct interested. If the apprenticeship had been extended to all categories, the results would certainly have been better.

with this I want to say that your idea cannot be generalized (“the young man at first must learn therefore cannot complain if they do not pay him”), because it depends on how much situations allow the young man to “survive” in this situation.

That's where we disagree. the economic condition of the neolaureate (or neodiplomato, that we all know which is...) cannot be a reason for just rivalry to get some free service, or maybe paid. As I said before, companies are not charitable entities.

however "bad" the last statement may appear, it should be pointed out that each company, large or small, has duties, both law and ethics, towards investors. the spa has this duty towards the shareholders, the individual company or the professional has the same duties towards them. These duties concern investment and pay of the invested capital. the administrator who decides to train and pay someone, without a precise plan of insertion fruit of the subject in the company staff, maybe it will appear of good heart, but it is a bad administrator who sooner or later will bring harm to the company, investors and consequently also to the employees.

and I at this point must say fortunately there are people who do not think like you and look at what is behind a poor neolaureate

I repeat to these lines in two different ways, a formal one that is likely to be taken for polemic (while it does not want to be absolutely it), the other more eulcorate, although in essence it expresses the same concept.

1. I tell you that fortunately there are companies that do not look at what is behind anyone, because these companies are the healthy ones, that invest oculately and that they guarantee not only their survival, but also growth, which implies greater employment, even for the graduates.

2. I tell you that luck is not so much to find someone who pays you to get ahead, but who can see in you the will to be a resource for the company. in this, much depends also on the candidate: who conducts interviews for the selection of staff can decide whether it is worth the risk of supporting someone who tomorrow may turn out to be a resource, but it is not (and should not be) an automatic thing.

in the forums you often read tips of the tone "who cares, you do a year there, and in the meantime you look for something better". This is the most destructive attitude you can imagine: destructive for companies, which from these "candidates" must be protected; destructive for those who face the world of work with these "ethical principles", which then lead to the idea that everything always settles in a mutual exploitation.

 

[ale47p]

...
in the forums you often read tips of the tone "who cares, you do a year there, and in the meantime you look for something better". This is the most destructive attitude you can imagine: destructive for companies, which from these "candidates" must be protected; destructive for those who face the world of work with these "ethical principles", which then lead to the idea that everything always settles in a mutual exploitation.

without controversy, see it from this point of view: money is there or is not there, it is a very, very simple thing. When you go shopping, they don't want your back, they want the money. Somehow you have to take it. As in prison I don't want to go, I prefer an honest way. If, to take the money, after graduation go to collect radicchio, not mature of certain technical experience. You'll end up with your broken back. easy.

If the company didn't want my money, I would never have anything to do with my previous owners. they have always tried to keep me alone and exclusively for my professionalism. There is no love in all this. the juice of the speech of the "ethical principle" as you call it, in the end, in the real world, is a mere exchange, to me it seems so. "You have the rent to pay and go to work," said the old essay.
other than. that then I like my work, that they have always treated me more or less well, that they have always paid me, that I have always behaved well, does not change the fact that I take the salary because I complete the work shift.

If one is "wrong" I think he has to change work, I will always recommend it.
I am the first to say that a company must do its own interests, but the same applies to human beings, who first of all are human beings, who sleep with thoughts and wake up more or less well or badly in the morning.

There is probably a point where one feels "arrived".
Here, in my opinion, until then, one has to do the ass and try to improve his life. otherwise it was worth enlisting in the army.

 

[Stan9411]

I'm sorry @exxon but I continue to read in your words the thought of those who, as a boy, have never faced logistic/economic/burocratic difficulties in bringing together the post-graduate insertion phase and everyday life. your speeches are right from a formal point of view and business management, but as ale47p says I can't pay rent by giving my ass (excuse Frenchism) and my family I always learned that if you want to make an investment on a person, you have to put it in condition to work even in an acceptable psychophysical condition. This attitude style marines (neo-laureate you are no one, sgobba and then we see) of which I often read on the forum, I know so much about those nostalgic reminiscences (style “when there was leverage in the army then they came on educated boys!”, but this is ot), of which older users go proud but that nowadays according to me does not suit anyone: the boy works with a little less satisfaction (no matter what he likes to do) and the company risks burning a talent for two ears compared to his business trip. no one wants the moon, but a few hundred euros a month to cover the expenses, for the first 6/8/10 months, I don't think they are an uncultivated hole. all the great and great structured realities (mechanical, automation, services) with which I have been able to speak guarantee from 200 to 800 € per month to an intern if the internship offer them. to me it seems the attitude of those who know how things work out there.
then continue to generalize: “In my time it was so for everyone” ... you see that those you knew lived your own extra-work conditions. .

 

[Stan9411]

and try to tell them to those companies there that if they pay an intern while teaching him the job, then they are charity institutions...

 

[exxon]

you can make all the assumptions you want on my economic condition of those years, but it has nothing to do with what I wrote.

Besides this, it does not even correspond to truth that he has said that companies should not pay the stagists (if so, he reports where I would write it).

I said that it is wrong that the intern demands it as some kind of right acquired.

as I said that the neo-prise cannot claim to be formed instead of working, but must give at least how much it receives, because companies are not charitable entities.

if in your historical-social vision, these statements correspond to being fascist... What do you want, they're opinions.

 

[MassiVonWeizen]

is wrong the concept that the intern demands it as some kind of acquired right.

be careful that it is not that you have to demand it, it is due. I'll send you back to this post https://www.cad3d.it/forum1/threads/dubbi-su-proposta-di-lavoro.55096/#post-429009

 

[exxon]

a moment: I am not saying that the company should not follow those that are the legislative impositions (we would miss anything else). Mine is an assessment of how things should be.

I believe that internships and alternation school-work are a failure on all fronts. what should be done is to make the apprenticeship available for each category and without age limits. a real apprenticeship, with long term duration and salary of the apprentice that grows linearly with time (and therefore with the preparation and the possibility of performance offered).

an internship of a few months is time thrown from both sides. we do not talk about the alternation of school-work which means only subtraction of time to the preparation of students (as if there was need...).

 

[antonio_sc]

I always believed that dealing with a person like a human being and not like a piston or a gear of a machine is something that sooner or later repays. .
there are several articles and management texts that highlight how the "motivation" is an added value for companies (I don't say that I am an emeritus x). Having a "motivated" person who works in his organization makes much more than having a "disengaged/disallined" subject that among other things does not bring negativity in the organization. .
Now..I don't think that a Sicilian who is forced to work for 800 euros per month 10 hours a day, as a mechanical engineer or other job in Piedmont , with a thick pay, both "motivated" to work in a company..probably it does because it is the only way he has to move forward at that precise moment of his life...
moral of the fairy tale? Why if you treat me like a "Pneumatic Cylinder" I should repay you tomorrow when, do my blessed experience, can I aspire to much more?
If you go away when you start having the cards on the table to give added value.. then you are an ungrateful or worse still there is always the entrepreneur who complains that the "boys today do not want to work in the factory". .
Perhaps I will mistake conceptually but also during an internship a person, in his small, a minimum contribution always...the time that that person dedicates to work is not different from the time that devotes a dishwasher, a bricklayer or a doctor training in hospital/health facilities (even the latter take 1600 net euros per month..). .
you can invest in so many futility but you still can't invest on people and on human capital (at least in the vast majority of cases)... a collaborator is "cultivated" should not be "used". ..even for this reason I think this country is going to subsurface (other than organizational/political/social phenomena). . .
Maybe I'm wrong, but this is my idea.