fly

[sacal]

Hello.
I kindly ask for a detailed explanation of why the flywheel is used exclusively in mono or bi-cylindrical machines and not in those with 8 or more cylinders.
Thank you in advance. :finger:

 

[radio]

First of all, I am self-proclaiming as a temporary volunteer replacement of the excellent moderator, telling you that a small presentation is obligatory the first time.
As for the flywheel I am not able so on two feet to carry out a complete discussion on the subject, and since it is Saturday night (!) I limit myself to providing you a small track from which to leave, maybe then someone else will respond more in detail.
the main function of the gadget called flywheel is to accumulate rotation energy during the active phase of a cylinder of an internal combustion engine, and then return it during the passive phases of exhaust, compression suction.
a single-cylindrical motor therefore needs a larger flywheel than a more fractionated engine, of equal capacity because the active phase has every two motor turns (4t).
it is not true that the flywheel is only found in mono and bicylinder engines, even the twelve or more cylinders have it, also because besides accumulating energy the flywheel guarantees a more regular operation of the engine; for its sizing is also taken into account the type of application of the motor, if sporty the flywheel will be lighter to make the motor more nervous, even at the expense of the regularity of operation to the minimum or to the low regimes.
In recent years, bi-mass flyers are increasingly widespread, only on diesel engines if not mistaken, where the classic monolithic structure has been replaced by several masses connected to that of the engine shaft springs, this is done to increase the comfort of gear and reduce the vibrations at the minimum and in the start phase.

I suppose you wanted to say eight cylinders and not eighty.

 

[sampom]

Hello.
I kindly ask for a detailed explanation of why the flywheel is used exclusively in mono or bi-cylindrical machines and not in those with 8 or more cylinders.
Thank you in advance. :finger:

What do you mean, "machine"? do you refer to the widest possible meaning of the term (i.e. an engine that is by definition a machine?) or do you have any particular application or vehicle in mind?
However you are wrong, a flywheel (or volanic masses) is always there, in all engines, even if you do not see a real "affector" record (style bonfires to understand us:smile.
the motor shaft itself, with the "plants" or "mannaries", is dimensioned in order to obtain a well determined inertia. the rotor of the ignition also makes the sails of flywheel, the clutch group and many other organs are volanic masses that are to be calculated according to this. .

then if you want a " detailed explanation" you should first ask a detailed/specific and clear question.

..ah, and still welcome

greetings
Mar

 

[Exatem]

are about twenty years that to the traditional flywheel, consisting of a cast iron disk on the motor shaft, has been flanked the bi-mass with the aim to reduce the vibrations and noise especially to the low regimes (round 1300-1800'). in practice the flywheel has been divided into two parts a solidarity to the motor shaft and the other, through the clutch, to the transmission. between the two discs, there are springs immersed in the fat that allow a relative rotation up to 60-70°. In this way, the "critical point" descends from 1300' to about300 (so below the minimum). the greater complexity is however at the origin of problems unknown to the "classical" version. For example, when starting, the engine crosses the "critical regime" causing considerable fluctuations in the masses of the flywheel.
the first car to use it was the bmw 324d in 84, the first Italian, the lance k td 2.4 in 94.
as it says radio, all right except that even some gasoline cars mount the bi-mass, for example the saab 9.3 2000 turbo 150cv.
As Sam says...
Welcome.

 

[Er Presidente]

For example, when starting, the engine crosses the "critical regime" causing considerable fluctuations in the masses of the flywheel.
the first car to use it was the bmw 324d in 84, the first Italian, the lance k td 2.4 in 94.
....saab 9.3 2000 turbo 150cv.

That's why the "modern" turbodiesel when they start, they look like three-cylinder shit!
:smile:

The saab is the saab, the rest is boring!
:smile:

 

[cacciatorino]

That's why the "modern" turbodiesel when they start, they look like three-cylinder shit!
:smile:

The saab is the saab, the rest is boring!
:smile:

But my mechanic told me that they break often and repair them costs an exaggerated figure, even 1000 euros... .

 

[Er Presidente]

But my mechanic told me that they break often and repair them costs an exaggerated figure, even 1000 euros... .

true, but often the problem comes from a bad state of the engine that prolongs the time of persistence to critical regimes.
minimum low, injectors messed up, candles not in place, starter scooter in disorder, battery in the cases.
At the end the flywheel breaks the springs and you have to change it, as there is no mechanic with the balls able to force you to solve the other problems, after 4 years (the time you need because you mess everything) you change the fly one year you and one as well and you sell the car for despair!
:smile:

 

[Fulvio Romano]

I think the answers are quite exhaustive. I just want to add something that has not been explicitly said.
the "motor machines of the type alternating regime" as the applied mechanical books say, do not provide a constant couple. at the counter therefore the result is that of a pair ripple that makes the sea sickness come and you dismantle the machine for vibrations. the more you increase the volanic inertias, the more this ripple is reduced of amplitude but the motor is less "ready".
therefore the greater the flyer the more increases the comfort, but decreases the driving brilliance.
In fact, however, the irregularity of the torque to the tree has different causes during the production of the motorcycle, and wanting to solve them directly with a flywheel on the hold (shaft in the case of the alternative motor) means having them all mixed and then abounding with the inertia of the flywheel. then we use distributed flying inertias during the production of the bike so as to round the torque peaks where they are born, without necessarily inflating too much the recovery of the engine.

I hope I've been clear enough. . .

 

[cacciatorino]

I hope I've been clear enough. . .

Ah yes, now you reminded me that at the university they told us that on the trees of the big marine engines they put pendulums that rotate along with the tree, propio with the function you talk about!
http://books.google.it/books?id=kbw...fb3pzmcg&ei=it&ei=i=pwl_su6coiyssajkwkwpwl=f)

 

[marcof]

are about twenty years that to the traditional flywheel, consisting of a cast iron disk on the motor shaft, has been flanked the bi-mass with the aim to reduce the vibrations and noise especially to the low regimes (round 1300-1800').

(cut)

the greater complexity is however at the origin of problems unknown to the "classical" version. For example, when starting, the engine crosses the "critical regime" causing considerable fluctuations in the masses of the flywheel.

if I catch the "scientist" (to be read with Neapolitan accent to the totò) that designed this bimasssa flyer of my ford tcdi I impalo...
after 90.000 km the fucking gadget split completely after a couple of months of various triggers to the ignition. Of course I had to replace the clutch, which otherwise would have done some 80.000 kilometers quietly.
I hope that the thousand and euros I spent can go to them (to the designer) in medicines against chronic dysentery:

Hi.

p.s. there would be in list for the scaffolding also the other "scientist" oil radiator designer of the same nasty car, that has yielded (in the highway, of course...) shooting me much of the oil in the cooling circuit with consequent replacement of the radiator itself, radiator water, piping various washing cooling circuit and other amenities for 900 and broken euro.
not bad eh for a car whose engine they had or told me wonders as to reliability?

 

[Exatem]

true, but often the problem comes from a bad state of the engine that prolongs the time of persistence to critical regimes.
minimum low... skin

This is one of the main causes. in particular a battery not at the maximum of the conditions.

if I catch the "scientist" (to be read with Neapolitan accent to the totò) that designed this bimasssa flyer of my ford tcdi I impalo.. .
after 90.000 km the fucking gadget split completely after a couple of months of various triggers to the ignition. Of course I had to replace the clutch, which otherwise would have done some 80.000 kilometers quietly.
I hope that the thousand and euros I spent can go to them (to the designer) in medicines against chronic dysentery

Hi.

p.s. there would be in list for the scaffolding also the other "scientist" oil radiator designer of the same nasty car, that has yielded (in the highway, of course...) shooting me much of the oil in the cooling circuit with consequent replacement of the radiator itself, radiator water, piping various washing cooling circuit and other amenities for 900 and broken euro.
not bad eh for a car whose engine they had or told me wonders as to reliability?

the tendency is to replace the bi-mass, with a traditional flywheel at the expense of the comfort of march.
The figures are those. :frown:

 

[marcof]

true, but often the problem comes from a bad state of the engine that prolongs the time of persistence to critical regimes.
minimum low, injectors messed up, candles not in place, starter scooter in disorder, battery in the cases.

I knew about the importance of the battery in order to overcome this inconvenience, which had predicted me as remote quqindi in my case the car was in perfect order, including battery. to the communication of the infamous diagnosis, while santionavo as a Turkish, the mechanic told me that in fact the start of a diesel is always quite stressful so are things that can happen. But vaff...

at the end the flywheel breaks the springs and you have to change it

And in my case, I saw him, even the clutch. . .

as there is no mechanic with balls able to force you to... (cut)

There is no mechanic with balls, point.

After four years (the time you need to mess up everything) you change the fly one year and one as well and you sell the car for despair!

Are you interested in a focus sw tcdi? :tongue:


Hi.

 

[cacciatorino]

true, but often the problem comes from a bad state of the engine that prolongs the time of persistence to critical regimes.
minimum low, injectors messed up, candles not in place, starter scooter in disorder, battery in the cases.

but such consequences for causes of that genus are symptomatic of a design at least "adventurous". ....

 

[Er Presidente]

but such consequences for causes of that genus are symptomatic of a design at least "adventurous". ....

Now cars are designed to lose, after four years, it's all "more."

 

[marcof]

Now cars are designed to lose, after four years, it's all "more."

Then I propose to close the forum "automotive" so much we write, evidently, only caxxate! :tongue:
stan li to think of the design (and they should all go to wedge since they have reduced to remake the towards models of 50 years ago), to the surfaces in class a, zebra stripes and similar minchiate then make engines that drink like lavandin, pollute and last less, made the proportions, of one of the three main ones of the space shuttle.
I would give him the "chunki modelling", but here I can't say where:smile:

Hi.