problem update together 3d from expression list

[DavidNX]

Good morning to all, I looked around but an answer to my problem I can't find it.

I have a 3d set composed of n°6 components.

These 6 components are bound in the assemblies on csys whose position with respect to origin is regulated by some expressions.

inside the axieme I use the linked-body command to be able to combine the 6 components in a single solid and perform all the processes that the finished model needs. (it is multi-stage hydraulic machines and each hydraulic component must be modeled separately and then be combined into a single body)

until some time ago I never had any problems in changing the position of csys through an expression defined by the user, as it never gave me problems increasing or decreasing the number of stages of the machine that I'm modeling through the use of the key-array command, varying the value of long x copies always through a variable in the expression list.

from a few days though, working on a new machine, I have problems updating the model, after I go to vary the value of x-ray copies.

to explain to you, it seems that unigraphics first upgrades the axieme feature tree, but skips everything about linked body, csys position regulated by expressions etc, with the result that crashes the model.
the absurd thing is that, finished this "first" update, noug starts with a second update, in which everything is updated regarding linked body and related key arrays.

Therefore, during the "first" update, I get out many messages of
error related to features that jump, but at the end of the whole procedure, then even after the "second update", in the tree there is no trace of error, and also visually I see to video the model that is updated in 2 sessions, and not all at the same time as so far it happened to me.


I clarify that those I call "first" and "second" update happen in rapid succession. . at the end of the first, the dialogue bar presents the written: done updating feature, but immediately automatically part the second update, which in turn at the end shows the same written done updating feature.


I apologize if I have not explained very well, I remain waiting for your help and available for any clarification,

David

 

[DavidNX]

I forgot: version nx 6.0.2.8

 

[ceschi1959]

Good morning to all, I looked around but an answer to my problem I can't find it.

I have a 3d set composed of n°6 components.

These 6 components are bound in the assemblies on csys whose position with respect to origin is regulated by some expressions.
inside the axieme I use the linked-body command to be able to combine the 6 components in a single solid and perform all the processes that the finished model needs. (it is multi-stage hydraulic machines and each hydraulic component must be modeled separately and then be combined into a single body)

until some time ago I never had any problems in changing the position of csys through an expression defined by the user, as it never gave me problems increasing or decreasing the number of stages of the machine that I'm modeling through the use of the key-array command, varying the value of long x copies always through a variable in the expression list.

from a few days though, working on a new machine, I have problems updating the model, after I go to vary the value of x-ray copies.

to explain to you, it seems that unigraphics first upgrades the axieme feature tree, but skips everything about linked body, csys position regulated by expressions etc, with the result that crashes the model.
the absurd thing is that, finished this "first" update, noug starts with a second update, in which everything is updated regarding linked body and related key arrays.

Therefore, during the "first" update, I get out many messages of
error related to features that jump, but at the end of the whole procedure, then even after the "second update", in the tree there is no trace of error, and also visually I see to video the model that is updated in 2 sessions, and not all at the same time as so far it happened to me.


I clarify that those I call "first" and "second" update happen in rapid succession. . at the end of the first, the dialogue bar presents the written: done updating feature, but immediately automatically part the second update, which in turn at the end shows the same written done updating feature.


I apologize if I have not explained very well, I remain waiting for your help and available for any clarification,

David

I think of three possible causes:
the first component loading: in load options there is a flegghettino on 'use partial loading', if activated the axieme loads only the geometry needed to display the reference set (magari i csys are not part of this reference set)
the second update of the assieme: look whether in tools>update>delay interpart there is or not the flag, if there were you have to give 'hand' the update
the third in using the link that can be made at timestamp or not.

savory say

p.s. I sent you the message as I saw your saying of 6.0.2.8 (the image is in fact related to 4): I didn't even install it because with instability problems and anything, maybe it's a version problem but I would look at what I wrote you above.

 

[DavidNX]

I think of three possible causes:
the first component loading: in load options there is a flegghettino on 'use partial loading', if activated the axieme loads only the geometry needed to display the reference set (magari i csys are not part of this reference set)
the second update of the assieme: look whether in tools>update>delay interpart there is or not the flag, if there were you have to give 'hand' the update
the third in using the link that can be made at timestamp or not.

savory say

p.s. I sent you the message as I saw your saying of 6.0.2.8 (the image is in fact related to 4): I didn't even install it because with instability problems and anything, maybe it's a version problem but I would look at what I wrote you above.

First of all, thank you for the answer, below I answer to your points:

1) by default I did not flagged the option "load interpart date", I however checked but it is not flagged
2) I don't have the flag on "delay interpart"
3) links, as always, I made them "at current timestamp", at the precise point that I care about.

Unfortunately, none of the three hypotheses.

I still don't know how to explain.

I wonder why.... Until now no problem, and now I find myself with this double update, and all the problems that it entails.... without even realizing why it happens....

 

[ceschi1959]

First of all, thank you for the answer, below I answer to your points:

1) by default I did not flagged the option "load interpart date", I however checked but it is not flagged
2) I don't have the flag on "delay interpart"
3) links, as always, I made them "at current timestamp", at the precise point that I care about.

Unfortunately, none of the three hypotheses.

I still don't know how to explain.

I wonder why.... Until now no problem, and now I find myself with this double update, and all the problems that it entails.... without even realizing why it happens....

try to set the load optins as in the image I attach to you:
partial loading not flagged
load interpart data flagged
load parents immediate level only

If you want you can make a simplified model (e.g. cutters) and if the problem persists maybe post it that I give an eye.

Hi.

 

[DavidNX]

try to set the load optins as in the image I attach to you:
partial loading not flagged
load interpart data flagged
load parents immediate level only

If you want you can make a simplified model (e.g. cutters) and if the problem persists maybe post it that I give an eye.

Hi.

Nothing to do, yet double update.
the absurd thing is that with the old files, made weeks and months ago, it does not give me any kind of problem, and the update of the file together and the components happens simultaneously and not in 2 separate and successive phases as it happens now.

load options have always been the same, as you have shown me with the only difference to flag at levels instead of immediate level only to load parents.

Whereas I have always left the same master, now I try to make a model with cubes and see if the problem persists, and in case I can post it.

 

[DavidNX]

I tried using the master but assembling one component, simplified to a simple cube with an extrusion on the side to identify its position.

I have made some screenshots as for reasons of confidentiality I cannot post the file:


the first screen shows the model in configuration 12 stages.

At this point, I open the expression list, and I change the value of the stages, bringing it to 8.
I just press on apply, immediately gives me the error a transform-array (rectangular-array):

Trying to press on review the model, here's how the model looks when ug signals the error on the transform array:

As you can see, csys have adapted to the number of stages inserted in the expression list, but the alignment bond csys and consequently the linked body that is joined (cian cube), and then the transform array is made, remains in the position at 12 stages.

At this point, if I press on accept remaining, then accepting the errors that ug communicates to me, the model makes the "second" update, then updating the position of the component and its bond, and also updating the features of the tree.

If someone comes up with something... I'm here!

Thanks again,

available for further clarification,

David

 

[DavidNX]

So, I did some insights and found out something. .

Until now, we had always developed the first stage of assembling on nx4, except then switch to version nx6.0.2.8.

and it is precisely with this version of nx, which comes out this problem.

I attach a set made to the flight, very simple:


I added only one component, bound on a csys.
This csys is placed at a distance defined by the distance_x expression compared to the csys placed on the origin.
on the main csys a block is built, and then it is shredded with the yz plan of the csys on which the component is bound.
at this point a linked body of the component is made, and is joined to the previously trimmato block.

By changing the position of the csys on which the component is bound in the axieme by the distance_x expression, the model must update without any problem.

but this does not happen with the file that we have developed entirely on nx6.0.2.8, in fact trying to reduce the distance between csys, in the phase of updating the unigraphics model gives error as it fails to replicate the feature of union.
accepting the error, you start a second update of the model, and at this point the feature of union goes to good end.
to us it seems that unigrapchis makes a first update of the features contained directly in the axieme, and only in a second moment the position of the components, the bonds of assembling, and all that this entails.
to testimony of this, if I press on show current model when ug signals the mistake of the united, I see that the position of the bond and therefore of the component, has remained unchanged. (see attached screen) only after accepting the error, unigrpachis updates the position of the component and regenerates everything without problems.

If something comes to mind, tell me! :bekle:

 

[Primizio]

I have looked at your file, if it can help I have seen that changing the type of coupling from coincidence to distance the update takes place without errors. At least I do.

logically you must bind the distance bond value to the distance variable_x

Say hi.

 

[DavidNX]

hi primizio, actually putting as a "at distance" bond, and at the distance value you bind the distance_csys expression do not have errors.
But for the type of files I have to do it would be preferable to bind through csys, in fact that the example made provides only 1 component, while in our masters we sometimes have a number of components well superior.
Moreover, even speaking with our technical assistance, we must try to understand whether the problem lies in this version, and therefore in the align condition (that both csys or other datum is indifferent, it gives problems even with 3 align separated) or if there is some setting to change.

ps: For those who download my file, check to have flagged the option: interrupt update on error under a preference - modelling - edit.

if that option is not flagged, the update continues without giving the user any error, but this does not mean that there are....

 

[ceschi1959]

hi primizio, actually putting as a "at distance" bond, and at the distance value you bind the distance_csys expression do not have errors.
But for the type of files I have to do it would be preferable to bind through csys, in fact that the example made provides only 1 component, while in our masters we sometimes have a number of components well superior.
Moreover, even speaking with our technical assistance, we must try to understand whether the problem lies in this version, and therefore in the align condition (that both csys or other datum is indifferent, it gives problems even with 3 align separated) or if there is some setting to change.

ps: For those who download my file, check to have flagged the option: interrupt update on error under a preference - modelling - edit.

if that option is not flagged, the update continues without giving the user any error, but this does not mean that there are....

only today I return to the studio and took a look at the file with nx 6.0.5.3 mp4.
the error also gives it to me, even loading the component completely and putting as rs entire part.
Of course it is a good puzzle also because (it also changes you) the error gives me alone if I decrease the distance, while if the increase there is no error.
time allowing I will check again.
a suggestion: did you try with woodoo techniques?

 

[DavidNX]

only today I return to the studio and took a look at the file with nx 6.0.5.3 mp4.
the error also gives it to me, even loading the component completely and putting as rs entire part.
Of course it is a good puzzle also because (it also changes you) the error gives me alone if I decrease the distance, while if the increase there is no error.
time allowing I will check again.
a suggestion: did you try with woodoo techniques?

Hi.

the error only gives it to decrease because, if you think about it, it is precisely decreasing the distance between the two csys that when it comes to doing the united does not find "nothing" to which to join the target body, as the body tool is "more distant" and therefore disjoined.
while if you increase the distance, he still manages to replicate it. (at first it joins him in the "old" position, then makes the second update and joins him in the correct point. )

I know, it's not easy to explain in words, but the file speaks clear.

I contacted our assistance, and I know they opened a case (or something similar) to the siemens... Let's see they're answering us, I've asked yesterday.
in the end, if it is a bug of the version, just uan communication of the siemens, that I will attach to the file in delivery to the customer... I can't help it.

the absurd thing is that I tried to do the same exact file with nx4, so same operations link, all identical, I open it with nx6, and it works!
I mean, absurd!
At this point, it is a bug of the align bond of nx6... There is no more explanation. ...

the only difference between the two files is in the bond, which even if conceptually equal ends up giving this kind of problem! (always align csys is, but on nx6 as you know they have changed a lot how to view and insert constraints) :frown::frown::frown:

However, if you have any chance, please try to do the same simple together with a later version of nx6... to us arrived nx7.5 but still I did not install it. . .

 

[ceschi1959]

I tried to do everything from scratch with 6.0.5.3 and 7.5.4: same problem.
I have made a further test, if it may be useful: I have radiated the end of the block of the axieme so that it still failed the union (conditions of non manifold). Try it.
Hi.

 

[DavidNX]

Well, at this point, sincerely, this is seriously worrying.
I'm surprised how this problem never came out. .
for master model as we are accustomed to doing us, this is a big nice problem, automatic updating of assemblies by changing one or more expressions is one thing that up to version 4 worked and now inexplicably does not work.

from siemens, still no answer despite my reminder.... here in the forum nobody intervenes directly from siemens or some assistance in particular that can see this bug? (I can't say that by now.. )

 

[blackwing]

in the tools>update>interpart update menu you have? ?

 

[DavidNX]

in the tools>update>interpart update menu you have? ?

I made you a screenshot.

Anyway, I didn't flag the delay interpart... .

 

[blackwing]

sin, I thought it was that:

 

[ceschi1959]

Well, at this point, sincerely, this is seriously worrying.
I'm surprised how this problem never came out. .
for master model as we are accustomed to doing us, this is a big nice problem, automatic updating of assemblies by changing one or more expressions is one thing that up to version 4 worked and now inexplicably does not work.

if you want to add info I tried with nx5 both with mating conditions and with assemblies constraint and it works. so it should be a problem from nx 6 onwards.

from siemens, still no answer despite my reminder.... here in the forum nobody intervenes directly from siemens or some assistance in particular that can see this bug? (I can't say that by now.. )

assistance in this case does it directly siemens, who does assistance outside siemens does not have the tools to do so if it is actually a bug.

 

[The_Matrix]

if you want to add info I tried with nx5 both with mating conditions and with assemblies constraint and it works. so it should be a problem from nx 6 onwards.

assistance in this case does it directly siemens, who does assistance outside siemens does not have the tools to do so if it is actually a bug.

and the siemens that intervenes on the site is working to detroit 20 hours a day... So, this time, you bug. :tongue:

 

[ceschi1959]

and the siemens that intervenes on the site is working to detroit 20 hours a day... So, this time, you bug. :tongue:

What are you doing? Don't tell me you're resting!