search.pro (pro engineer wildfire 4.0)

[Pal_65]

Good morning and thank you in advance.
After so many years I find myself solving a new problem.
I do not use the pdm plm programmes.

in the company we use a networked server to 6 users/licences proe wildfire 4.0.
file opening operation is very slow.
Currently there are in search.pro about 1500 routes/directory of research/project.

we did some tests:
used a standard set that uses files in about 25 paths/directory on the server.

1) search.pro file with about 1500 search paths/directory.
outcome: 1 minute and 15 seconds opening together

2) search.pro file with about 25 search paths/directory.
outcome: 4 seconds opening together

3) copied the entire archive (the 1500 directories) locally, reset the search.pro that points to local directories.
outcome: 4 seconds opening together


I would like to have advice and comparison from you.

1) Are there any numerical limits in the number of directors to be placed in search.pro?
2) how should the network (servers, network cards, etc) be built to optimize this file search work?
3) other suggestions.

Thank you again.

 

[DANI-3D]

Hi.

I'm also in the same condition, with wf5. Luckily, for now, I can work locally. I think the limit is the speed of the network, but I'm not sure. We hope that some experts can give us some tips.

 

[Pal_65]

Thanks dani.
always in debt.

 

[320i S]

I hit my head years ago for a similar situation, I had not so many paths in search pro, but I had many similar mathematicians, generated by family table, in different family tables with often different names (a disaster in some cases, which forced to re-assemble also assemblies of some importance).

if you have come to have so many paths in search pro, it is time (and I can put my hand on fire that any company that does consulting would tell you the same thing) to make a choice between:
1- install a windchill (more or less extended according to your needs) deciding a road map for the upload of the projects that you consider valid from here to 3-4 years ( older projects, no sense import them, if it is necessary to open them for only viewing, just disconnect from windchill on-demand and any libraries not imported, import to need).

2- rationalize the archive, proceed to order and create a real historian (with so many paths, means that you do not have a consolidated historian)

in both cases, it's time to name a cad manager (if you don't already have it) that you worry every "tot" time to check the status of the archive, arrange if there is something wrong and if needed, "draw the ears" to those who do not pay attention.
the cad manager will have to create the library archive, organizing them at best, both for manual consultation with windchill, and if you continue to use the search pro.

personally, the arrivation of point 2 is much more risky and very long (every macro rationalization of the folders, demands to try if the projects considered "type" still work), while with windchill, the long part is the initial one, then the more the loaded projects increase, the more the loading speed increases.

attention if you have details managed with modification with internal revision index (i.e. with a parameter), because rationalizing or migrating on windchill, you may overwrite the historian.

with 6 users, however Windchill council, in 2016 (but already for a decade at least), is a choice that pays back in many ways and allows actions that with the only resource management, are impossible.

 

[Pal_65]

In-depth analysis.
Thank you.

I was cad manager in the past with intralink (addition).
These problems did not exist.
The penalizing aspect is only economic.
the choice is well weighted because to work properly it takes a license per user.
I ask for help and further clarification from you of the forum.
Thanks again.

 

[320i S]

intralinks like windchill, are programs made specifically to avoid all the pathetic management of localized files.
windchill is more in-depth as management and would be thought to replace even real management as400.

on economic penalisation, if you could discuss it, a practical example (which you surely know) is the management of changes and new versions.
as much as one can know the paths and structure of the archive folders, it will never arrive to have complete, precise and rapid control of these systems, and the more we go towards the push and complete customization of the projects/committees, the more these systems will be indispensable.

where I work now, the projects are completely closed and we are few users, libraries and possibilities of duplication we have very few, we have no windchill, but in many cases I feel the need.

an economic evaluation I would do it!

 

[blubossa]

Hi.
as it has already been said with the pdm the initial work is really much, but after it repays everything.... it is however necessary to change mindset from the operating point of view. . . .
I only recommend it if really necessary for complexity and amount of projects. . .

I had little experience about it, especially as cad manager, but enough to understand the work to do... .

bb

 

[320i S]

I agree.
the mentality of a use of a pdm (this is not only for windchill, but also for many other pdms, for example also the dassault enovia) is fundamental for use.

a thing that I have lived on my skin, which is worth in case we lose a couple of hours with who will install the system, is to make you understand what you need immediately that it functions and relegate other functions, however important, in a second moment, es: normally those who install it also immediately publish the objects for the viewer (productview or similar), with the initial risk of making some import errors with circular references etc.; Publishing proves at that point a real "football" for the system, which commits resources to the system slowing it down and does not serve anyone.

 

[DANI-3D]

All very clear. but remains a dark side, at equal working method, the considerable difference in performance between working locally and on the net. Is there a solution?

 

[320i S]

All very clear. but remains a dark side, at equal working method, the considerable difference in performance between working locally and on the net. Is there a solution?

windchill works in a "mixed" system, that is you have your workspace (in the latest version I don't know how much they can be shared), in local cache and replicated on the server, on which you load the library objects and where you save the new items you do.
every time you save (new or modified), you do it in the local cache, when you feel appropriate, do "update" to the workspace on the server.

so in reality you work locally and only to need interpelli the server.
but unlike working locally without pdm, each object is monitored by the server if new/modified/reading only.
you can allow you to download the same project in "n" workspace, do "n" different studies and only what can have a continuation, upload and others back up if necessary in resource management.
the first "bed" placed by the system, is that there cannot exist 2 objects with the same name, the second "bed" is that the existing objects in the windchill server, "command" on the objects of the workspace, which means that if an object is modified by another user before you, the system "knows", and will block you (and other remaining users) for any other complete change on the same object, until the user who

for my experience with windchill 9.1 (so a system I would say by now "old"), waits for communication with the server can be long when there is a lot of traffic and the "background method servers" are busy (a rare thing if you set the routine actions in a "furba" way).

 

[DANI-3D]

so it seems to me to understand that without pdm there are no valid solutions ... I will try to return to the charge with the direction for this investment, but I see it hard. Hopefully.

 

[320i S]

network performance is mainly related to the network itself (obvious), when worked with catia v6, I was tied to enovia (plm) that worked massively with the network, among other things with a cad server not on site, but in another establishment. . .
I do not tell you the difficulties in certain days to work, even because v6 does not make you complete math, but initially only screen geometry, then according to the demands, makes you the math editable (which means additional network access) and with 13 stations fall only them....

to say that in the case of a network not extremely performing, to train a little with the preparation of work, the accesses to the network with windchill, can be reduced a lot, the important is to have a dedicated server of good quality, a server that must also manage a file system for other users, or even mail, is the worst choice.

 

[Pal_65]

thanks to all for suggestions.

pdm undoubtedly solves file management.
I'm trying to get a closer look at the network.
my proof clearly demonstrates that the " search.pro " at 1500 paths / search directors supported (in local) by adequate data access, has no problem to work.
The scheme I would like to try is a powerful "network" with dedicated servers that supports designers.
cad server connected to the central server for backup and rescue.

But... that "motor " must support communication between server cad and individual users?
What network cards?

This is my gap (not easily filled) since those I consulted did not satisfy me yet.

 

[320i S]

in my humble opinion the network cad users-servers, should be directed, not through other servers that have definitely different priorities and relegate the server to a "slave" with obvious slowdowns.
at that point already a 1gb switch is able to cope with a dozen users, the rest can remain quite standard.

with pdm, or worse plm, according to me the requirements in terms of ram should at least increase of 1.5 times the recommended ones from those who propose the program, not because these latter mistakes, but because the requirements are always the result of different compromises.

then there is the variable of the heaviness of the data cad and unfortunately you can do only tests on the place.

 

[mamobono]

Perhaps I say trivial things for experts but it is good to specify for those who approach the pdm for the first time.

if you can take the pdm but ... know that to pass from one version cad to another (from wf4 to wf5 not versions m to understand us) it is not enough to update the cad but it is necessary to ensure that the pdm is compatible with the new version cad

if so you do not have to update the pdm and make the data conversion to the new pdm.

not to forget also the fact that new versions require always + powerful machines and new programs.

Therefore, while those who are in maintenance can always make an update of the cad on their own, in case of presence of pdm the thing becomes much more complicated (at least for me) and if made by their supplier ptc has not indifferent costs especially for small firms like the one in which I work.

I thought that cad and pdm were not connected and that they were developed independently, but I was wrong and that nobody told me.

minimum configuration that must have the host server of windchill:
hardware platform requirements:

the windchill pdm essentials package supports only a single physical or virtual box deployment.

• 12 gb of available ram (16 gb ram is recommended if concurrent server-side publishing is enabled)

• 2 processors (4 processors are recommended)

• 50 gb disk space for software components

• 100 gb minimum space for file vault location


platform requirements software:


• microsoft windows server 2008 r2

• microsoft windows .net framework 3.5.1

 

[320i S]

true what you say in general about the compatibility of pdm/plm with cad.
in the case of windchill, incompatibilities traced back to the passage from various wildfires to creo, where many windchill management actions, passed from the browser to creo real and proper.
I understand that the most "universal" remained windchill 9.1 with wildfire and creo, but it definitely has many other limitations given the age of the program (and what not to underestimate, has no common workspace function for team work)

However a plm does not replace itself as a release or its update of a cad, because there are many implications behind, it is as for management, there are many companies with as400 in window dos style....

returning to the requirements, for my experience, it should be considered how you want to integrate plm, in the case of windchill essential that is the lit version of windchill (a sort of modern intralink), I would say that 16 gb of ram are the minimum for 4 users (there are 2 servers and 2 background method servers, each takes away 1-2 gb then we put operating system, various services and perhaps the license of creo active for publications, the 12 g tightb already. . .

the 4 processors I also see these the minimum, but it is not necessary to be particularly powerful, the heavier processes are not many, of course if you want to make the server calculations fem... The speech changes a lot... .

the rest now I see it in the norm for a server cad, indeed, I think that now at the level of capacity of disks, there are no more particular problems.