roberto 2011
Guest
I want to believe it.
but how many programs outside that you will have to continue buying and using separately? It's already a lot of talk, but it's always announced as next. . .
I believe that even for very good programmers realize a building as it were true and give the possibility to do everything else in the same file, or almost, it is a good engagement. not by chance 3d programs that are around have all quite serious limitations and therefore possible disablings.
but, as they say, hope is always the last to die. :
but how many programs outside that you will have to continue buying and using separately? It's already a lot of talk, but it's always announced as next. . .
I believe that even for very good programmers realize a building as it were true and give the possibility to do everything else in the same file, or almost, it is a good engagement. not by chance 3d programs that are around have all quite serious limitations and therefore possible disablings.
but, as they say, hope is always the last to die. :
Tristan
Guest
if you felt self-desk...in 2009 for subscribers had been made available free just israi. the result was that less than 20% of users entitled downloaded and authorized the plugin. I told you everything!...
beyond acca, firm and serious company but I don't think it has the numbers to compete with the "big", I would be curious to know how it is put nemetschek with its allplan, archicad and vectorworks... since we talk about bim
gfrank
Guest
I know, and I used it, even if it wasn't the best at the time.
but the problem, is that add on (external to sh) are developed and made available after a few months from the release of revit.
this requires you to work with the old version until the update is released, or if you use the new one you cannot use the add on.
but the problem, is that add on (external to sh) are developed and made available after a few months from the release of revit.
this requires you to work with the old version until the update is released, or if you use the new one you cannot use the add on.
gfrank
Guest
Yes, however h works "only" for the Italian market. therefore should not develop a sw that must go well for the whole world (and with the various localizations).
as has often been reiterated by the Italian "guru" of revit, often the personalizations required for Italy are not taken into consideration by autodesk because, in fact, it affects only Italy.
I, however, work in Italy ...
Tristan
Guest
I personally recommend to my customers in subscriptions to download and install the autodesk software just released just to put the nose in news, but wait for the first update before bringing it "in production"
emigra :biggrin:
...herzo.
:36_9_2:
roberto 2011
Guest
the truth that softhouses and retailers are only interested in selling (we all have to live neh!?), but how much does it actually affect the problems of those who use those programs to really work with us?
and working really doesn't coincide with the "bravura" of those who do your courses. courses, however useful and intelligent, never cover true needs of the end user...
(Oh, my God, if you read me, you can ask me the royalties)
at least lower prices......:redface: :frown:
and working really doesn't coincide with the "bravura" of those who do your courses. courses, however useful and intelligent, never cover true needs of the end user...
(Oh, my God, if you read me, you can ask me the royalties)
at least lower prices......:redface: :frown:
Tristan
Guest
the prices have kept them but with little more they give you cares about software (read design suites various).
classroom courses, roberto, can not cover the needs of all and you will surely understand why. at that point you did 30, do 31 with a specific ad-hoc course for you that explains what to do and how to do it (and it is not said that revit actually covers 100% your needs, indeed...).
just last night at a course a participant asked me how to do in revit to return a 2d relief of an interior executed for trilaterations; ready my answer: "If you want to give yourself a hammer in the balls do it with revit, if you prefer to do it more sensibly you return it in autocad and it amounts in revit". He said: "But then what do I do with revit, if I have to continue working with autocad?" and I: "for this there are the suites; revit does not claim to do what autocad does and never will." and he: "but the suite costs a thousand euros more than the only revit"... I haven't seen us anymore! I don't know what kept me from not offending him. . .this would want a product that does everything (draw, returns reliefs, scents the environment, designs, makes photorealistic renderings with a click and maybe satisfies you sexually). I am sorry to say but unfortunately a similar product does not exist and will never exist, it is a mere utopia. and if anyone ever pulls out of the cylinder this giant rabbit would make you pay dearly! other than self-desk...
asalalp
Guest
exact...it's as if one wanted photoshop, illustrator, indesign in one software. . .
or who would like zbrush in 3dmax/maya
MirkoNEO
Guest
And I'm going back to fish. 
That's what I wanted to say in my first post: today as today you can't have a bim because there are no conditions to have it anywhere. Of course you have to push to go in that direction, but the bim is pure utopia now... I can find all the shortcuts that exist, all the tricks in the world... but it is not bim, remains semibim.. .
I repeat I do not speak to denigrate revit (which among those I used is best for general quality, but lower for niche jobs) but to demand the bim as for example make the manufacturers of machines that have everything on their machine (all information on how the machine is made, spare parts, life cycle.... ) in construction and especially in Italy it is very difficult! therefore ultimately revit is the art hub for the semibim, when both the market, the legislator and the technology will be really ready, then you can have the bim....
I'm going!
That's what I wanted to say in my first post: today as today you can't have a bim because there are no conditions to have it anywhere. Of course you have to push to go in that direction, but the bim is pure utopia now... I can find all the shortcuts that exist, all the tricks in the world... but it is not bim, remains semibim.. .
I repeat I do not speak to denigrate revit (which among those I used is best for general quality, but lower for niche jobs) but to demand the bim as for example make the manufacturers of machines that have everything on their machine (all information on how the machine is made, spare parts, life cycle.... ) in construction and especially in Italy it is very difficult! therefore ultimately revit is the art hub for the semibim, when both the market, the legislator and the technology will be really ready, then you can have the bim....
I'm going!
Tristan
Guest
...and in fact adobe has created the creative suites!
Tristan
Guest
I agree, but not always it is the fault of those who develop software; We also blame those who legislate and bureaucracy, who in Italy is more than an obstacle than an aid. However it is always better than having a piece of cheese paper with 4 rows pulled over:biggrin:
lance
Guest
this of a unique software that makes "the miracles" is a philosophy of thought that distinguishes those who deal with building. graphs, as rightly pointed out, have already exceeded it for some time but also in other areas (information research etc.) is not shared. for my part I think it is pure utopia, the same h products are a series of "modules" that are based on the same platform, but they are still different programs that one must learn to use at best.
MirkoNEO
Guest
♪ Tristan ♪
In fact, as I say in all my posts, the blame is of all the Italian system that I read with my feet, the professional who when he can try to bypass the obstacle, the programmers who are great programmers but to make him understand what really serves is like banging on a rubber wall, the customers who always try to get rid of their obligations or think that free work and air fields... all this put in a cauldron makes the famous "Italian system".
At this point we can feel satisfied with the point where revit is located, but also evaluate other roads.. .
In fact, as I say in all my posts, the blame is of all the Italian system that I read with my feet, the professional who when he can try to bypass the obstacle, the programmers who are great programmers but to make him understand what really serves is like banging on a rubber wall, the customers who always try to get rid of their obligations or think that free work and air fields... all this put in a cauldron makes the famous "Italian system".
At this point we can feel satisfied with the point where revit is located, but also evaluate other roads.. .
Tristan
Guest
concord in full, but you should take better and more comfortable roads, not displaced roads without exit or in counterhand (read cad 2d) :finger:
gfrank
Guest
true, but at least h has created a common platform, which does not need interchange files, or at least, where it serves the interchange sw provided to realize it herself.
instead, except a few niches, it has as file of interchange, among its products, the dwg.
for example the compatibility of file exchange between acad and revit is almost nothing, except with 2d files, or simil 3d. a lot of 3d information is lost.
I remember that in the computer field, the language of interchange of data has always been a big problem in order to be able to dissolve the various sw, until they have decided to use "typologies" that allow to dialogue between them.
in good substance, in drawing 2d, in fact, the standard of dialogue has become dwg (and yes that there are others), but in 3d we are still at the dawn.
Another flaw, in revit is the possibility to save in previous versions. if they do the tool (informatic) to update the families of the previous version, I don't understand why they don't do the opposite (naturally with all the limits of the information that "force" is lost).
that is a way to "force" customers to subscription? :biggrin:
lance
Guest
attention, with my intervention I did not intend to defend self-desk that among other things to behaviors from " monopolist sex" that are just not in my ropes. I meant simply to say that the conduct of all the process of design, bureaucratic etc. can not happen with only one instrument, but that from the professional there must be the will to learn/experience new solutions (also at cost of sacrifices) keeping the good and discarding what is not going. the question is not that simple. revit despite what is thought is the subject of important developments every year. . .some so to speak frontend i.e. visible to all, and these are sometimes not so eclarant. are those to understand that they say to roberto that the product is firm from the first version:biggrin:. Many, and I assure you are important, concern the core of the program, these are not visible and create big problems of retro conpathy. we take for example a more mature software as max but that by its nature is the subject of a massive and continuous development. Only in the last version has been made back compatible and only with the previous version!
said this given the sub discourse is not that they damage the soul:tongue::wink:
said this given the sub discourse is not that they damage the soul:tongue::wink:
Tristan
Guest
revit exists in three "versions" and the platform is the same. autocad has been "verticalized" in n different products and obviously the platform is common. acca has only invented hot water, with the plus of Italian legislation (which, for charity, is not little)
On the contrary, they communicate with the most diverse formats, from the various standards (dxf, dwg, stl etc) to the relatively new fbx that takes behind also the info on materials, lights and rooms.. .addirittura have invented the .adsk format to bring the batches from revit to civil3d!
roberto 2011
Guest
Well, if I stay with the same problems, I don't see what I should appreciate. Probably if they didn't do those internal improvements would be even worse...
However, beyond the re-invitation to do other courses (yet!?), removed the problem of alignment between one plan and another, no one has faced concrete answers to my long list. everything depends only on my ignorance or on something actually there is no solution yet?
I speak of revit of course, what I took confiding in the coupling with autocad and currently it is no longer possible to unleash. I obviously had "confided" too... :biggrin:
on h it seems to me that it has not been clarified sufficiently that all the myriad of programs, strictly with Latin desinences or pseudo-Latins, in reality they involve a massacre and a compulsory loyalty that perhaps exceeds the same subscription of adesk... Or not? !
It will be that when I feel too encircled I feel the hive coming.... :frown:
gfrank
Guest
@tristan
provided that the sw h and adesk are not comparable, as they operate in different "sectors" or at the most complementary, and you will not be able to make any comparison (however partial) until the exit of the buildingus, my comparison between the two sh or between their sw, has been taken to compare the modalities of exchange of data between their products.
If necessary revit must be compared with other products of the same type, allplan, archicad, vw, which I do not know.
What I wanted to highlight is that to date, the products contained in adesk suites work pretty well in sectors (revit/autocad/3ds), data transfer between different sectors is still to be developed.
Moreover, revit, it still has big gaps in creating ouput data that can be used directly, referring to me in particular to the abachi, relationships, rai, etc., if not through the use of external addons.
vice versa, h has developed an interchange format between its sw much more evolved than adesk.
Moreover h, in my opinion (in the building branch), probably it is "stufata" to chase the various architectural sw sh, to import the data from acad/r/ap/ac to create data of imput for its own sw, and decided to create one of its own.
I don't know if the project will go in place, and if it will be valid, but in my opinion it deserves attention, if nothing else has "declared" what it intends to do.
If this is hot water or not, I don't know how to tell you, but this project, in intentions, meets my working needs.
Unfortunately, today, adk does not communicate anything about the developments of its products. all you know is because "someone to say/I heard say..." and things like this.
for this, I decided to put myself to the window and "understand" the evolution of revit. in fact I did not pass to the suite.
provided that the sw h and adesk are not comparable, as they operate in different "sectors" or at the most complementary, and you will not be able to make any comparison (however partial) until the exit of the buildingus, my comparison between the two sh or between their sw, has been taken to compare the modalities of exchange of data between their products.
If necessary revit must be compared with other products of the same type, allplan, archicad, vw, which I do not know.
What I wanted to highlight is that to date, the products contained in adesk suites work pretty well in sectors (revit/autocad/3ds), data transfer between different sectors is still to be developed.
Moreover, revit, it still has big gaps in creating ouput data that can be used directly, referring to me in particular to the abachi, relationships, rai, etc., if not through the use of external addons.
vice versa, h has developed an interchange format between its sw much more evolved than adesk.
Moreover h, in my opinion (in the building branch), probably it is "stufata" to chase the various architectural sw sh, to import the data from acad/r/ap/ac to create data of imput for its own sw, and decided to create one of its own.
I don't know if the project will go in place, and if it will be valid, but in my opinion it deserves attention, if nothing else has "declared" what it intends to do.
If this is hot water or not, I don't know how to tell you, but this project, in intentions, meets my working needs.
Unfortunately, today, adk does not communicate anything about the developments of its products. all you know is because "someone to say/I heard say..." and things like this.
for this, I decided to put myself to the window and "understand" the evolution of revit. in fact I did not pass to the suite.
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