"new license files" an escamotage to claim money from out of service

[Parametric_Ozzy]

The problem also exists with if: the tax to pay is the same, and sincerely I would not like to be a dealer-var, taken between the incudine and the hammer.

I also spoke with a cocreated salesman and told me that there's also something to pay, but we're at a lower order of magnitude (always too much, even 20 euros).

strange that co-create make pay being now under ptc hat.

I share with you that it is always too much it was also only 1 euro.

 

[MBT]

I share with you that it is always too much it was also only 1 euro.

mha, I a handful of €uri also accept them
in the end I am out of maintenance and my request must be somehow "processed", both from a pc and from a person.
This has a cost, of course, and it is right that I pay it and not "colletivity".
but this price must be fair and not unfair... .

 

[cacciatorino]

mha, I a handful of €uri also accept them
in the end I am out of maintenance and my request must be somehow "processed", both from a pc and from a person.
This has a cost, of course, and it is right that I pay it and not "colletivity".
but this price must be fair and not unfair... .

Actually, no, because the service you use doesn't give you any advantage, it's just for them to protect their business, so it's right if they pay for it. as if the bartender from which you take the coffee made you pay a surcharge for "management locks and locks" of the bar... :smile:

 

[marcof]

yesterday the other night I went close to having to request a new license. I'll tell you how it went.
no longer started the home pc where I installed the home license of swx. apart from the fan and some flashing leds did not give signs of life. I thought about the mother-going plate and immediately came to mind this discussion as the swx license is generated on the basis of the hardware (cpu, motherboard, hd) and if one of them fails the license remains on the swx server but you can't access it if you change hardware.
after several attempts, a bit of panic and some moccolo I managed to identify the problem in a failed ram module. that the pc is broken.
yesterday morning I wanted to deepen what would happen in the case of an important hardware failure resulting in impossibility to recover and transfer the license so I phoned to those who assist me.
the answer was that the reactivation of the license is Free as it is a few minutes operation to do on the license server to make sure that I can restart with a new hardware and regenerate the code. do it free for their customers whether they are in assistance or not.
Obviously weekly hardware breaks could become suspicious and before reactivating the whole maybe they check that you do not play strange games.
ah, for the record, I am a client "peanuts" , with only one lousy license and more in basic version... :redface:
Until it lasts, that is, until they do it for free, I think it's more than correct and hope they don't change their mind.

there is to say that unfortunately in these things you are in the hands of the choices that from time to time come from the software house, regardless of the fact that the decisions on the management of the licenses are lawful of the client and vessatorie towards it that you have purchased a software and its license of use and should be in place until the end of time, having not contravened to any license agreement at its own time undersigned; I have any judge would blame those who apply stutter like those in question in the thread.
In short, it seems to me that these gentlemen change the cards in the table with too much lightness and above all they have the deck marked to always win.
when even solidworks decided to adopt these systems in order to make money I certainly an appointment from a lawyer who deals with contractual law I take it and possibly on the second appointment I go with a train organized specifically to welcome the many misfortune companions who want to give their oblivion for a just cause, where "fall" is to be understood in a legal sense

 

[Matteo]

I say mine as a former commercial (spaceclaim, now only consultant pre/post sale) but also as a user (now solidworks, through infusion, first proe/prom): the purchase of a software is not to be compared to the purchase of a material good, but to that of a "immaterial" or "cultural" good, a little like a consultancy: is the usual question of joke on engineers' forums ("the cost is not that of mounting a bolt, but of the time spent to know where it should be mounted")

for this reason the 1390€ are definitely disproportionate to the cost of creating a license file (0,01€), but (in my opinion) the request is absolutely legitimate.



according to me the problems, or rather the causes, are others, but they would be to be deepened in other threads, here we would be out of topic:

• Why not change software?
• how much does the commercial network affect software costs (so much, I say so for seeing this world on the other side)?
• because the cost of licenses (I don't speak of the software house in question that I don't know, but of others among those mentioned) is obtained practically by replacing the symbol € to the symbol $ and not converting the currency? (6000$ > > 6000€)
• is there real competition in the software market, or are we "trapped" by excessive "transversalizations" (the same house provides cad, fem, cfd, pdm and chosen one can not choose others if not complicating life? )
• because in the world of cad the exchange formats (step) still do not work as you must (I declare that I cannot pass the list of features from one cad to another, but as an analyst I fem regularly go crazy in importing step from one system to another, as if there were "different versions")
• Why in Italy the online sale of the software stenta to take off?
• for an interventionist state, like the Italian one, does not find 10 million euros to develop (magari in collaboration with some polytechnic) a free and open basic product (modelling 3d, table, export dxf and dwg) that for less than 1000€ per year would satisfy the needs of all micro-companies that use pira_ta products or draw with the 2d "of luck" provided together with the machine?
• development costs really concern common users (99%) functions or spread over all development costs (or better than implementation) of "vip" customers?

Perhaps these are the reasons why they happen requests of this type 1390€ (which, I repeat, remain legitimate in a context like the current one).

 

[marcof]

the purchase of a software is not to be compared to the purchase of a material good, but to that of a good "immaterial" or "cultural"

I apologize for the frankness, but this aura of nobility that you want to put behind the software to me has always seemed an incredible strawberry, I would say almost a catch for the cuxo.
Let us remember that they release software that must first be tested, free, by beta testers, and when they go out with the sp0 there is to be recommended to the Madonna to start working.
so please let these things stand on immaterial and cultural goods. I buy a cad that has to do what is written in the manual and little cares about how complex its programming is; the 6-7-8 thousand and beyond euros that you pay are good, they work immediately and are spendable immediately.

a little like advice: is the usual question of joke on engineers' forums ("the cost is not that of mounting a bolt, but of the time spent to know where it should be mounted")

Are you kidding me? Let's talk about a cad, not to pay for a design.
I don't need any advice from solidworks, I need to use a cad and what I have to do without needing advice. They were worried about making them work at the prefecture. If I want advice on cad I pay the subscription.
you see those of the microsoft to say, that I know, to camilleri, that are offering him advice to write his novels since he uses word? to be beautiful.. .

so it seems superfluous to make pindaric flights, buying a software is accurately what is written in the license agreement of each software. if there is written that I purchase the license of use means that I must be able to use it without restrictions other than those provided in the license. it is written for example that the license can be revoked following the violation of articles 2, 3, 4 etc., related to copyright, piracy etc. nowhere is written that I am obliged to life to sign a maintenance contract because otherwise I am prevented from transferring the license.
Now, if I decide to stop at the xxx version of the cad yyy because its features are enough and advanced, I have the right to continue using it for as long as I think it is appropriate. If the software house decides to protect itself from piracy as it does for example solidworks to me is fine, as long as they allow me to operate for the license transfer as I always did when I bought a product by signing a regular contract where it was not written anywhere that the transfer was paid.

for this reason the 1390€ are definitely disproportionate to the cost of creating a license file (0,01€), but (in my opinion) the request is absolutely legitimate.

for me, they might ask for 10,000 for the license transfer, but they have to put it black on white. premium that I purchase the cad, i.e. I must write it in the license agreement, which is the only document that binds me with the software house. if changing the cards at the table the request is illegitimate And I'm sure a judge named in the case would show him green rots.

I add an image of the licensing info panel from my solidworks installation. see below the "fall" field what is written? Now tell me why in three years, five or ten I should see the unusable license if not behind the payment of what, in the misfortune hypothesis, would be nothing more than a "sweet"? .

 

[marcof]

Perhaps these are the reasons why they happen requests of this type 1390€ (which, I repeat, remain legitimate in a context like the current one).

you buy an apartment with a beautiful armored door from a real estate agency to live with your family. It happens that you lose the keys and to make a copy of the agency, that you have kept the code of the key for if, asks you to pay 20% of the cost of the entire apartment instead of the cost for the key as would any hardware, explaining that for the crisis the real estate market is in decline and they somehow have to continue to fill up to the suv from 100,000 euros.
What's going on? It happens that the peaceful matteo :smile: pisses like a biscia, goes to Ferrara, buys a crowbar, blue and chisel and that door, to return to his house, demolishes it. And it's good!
liked the parable? :wink:

 

[cacciatorino]

I imagine the executive of the "bigbosscadcorp" that reads this discussion and makes two laughs while alongside the desk sucks with watchful eye the mastino emh I mean the lawyer.... :biggrin:

 

[Matteo]

It happens that you lose the keys and to make a copy of the agency, that you have kept the code of the key for if, asks you to pay 20% of the cost of the entire apartment instead of the cost for the key as would any hardware, explaining that for the crisis the real estate market is in decline and they somehow have to continue to fill up to the suv from 100,000 euros.[...]What's going on? It happens that the peaceful matteo gets pissed like a biscia, goes to Ferrara, buys a crowbar, blue and chisel and that door, to return to his house, demolishes it. And it's good!
liked the parable?

Meanwhile I apologize if I have taken away a part of your post from the "quote" :smile:

I think they are different things: if you buy the door and the key remain the door and the key (before you lose it). If you buy a cad you have a dvd (not even what you buy spaceclaim with the discount, because you download it from the server :wink... the rest is "intellectual work" (don't be angry if I make the subtle on these things).

for the rest: I will I agree with you, the behavior of the software house in question is very appetizing, irritating, perhaps even "morally" incorrect, but is legitimate.

I recommend that you do not spend too much energy with the lawyer because it would be a lost cause (I say it having a ten-year experience as a ctp, a technical advisor in the licensing sector).

possibly the battle must be at marketing level and we are on the good road (I assure you that a thread like this could make someone angry).

Hi.

 

[cacciatorino]

(Deleted the listed original post, as required by the user. Sandra_me30)

I assure you that you're wrong, I've also lost some jobs because I didn't want to do the "Chinese" as you say... then there's also some reasons for oppurity to avoid raising doubts about the reputation of a forum user, but this is left to the sensitivity of the individual.

The idea that you want to carry out this discussion is that of greater respect that companies should have towards small customers.

 

[Matteo]

Speaking of Chinese: I just caught the "spider" of baidu that "read" this discussion :smile:
that it's the good time they index me in the cina?? ?

 

[marcof]

(Deleted the listed original post, as required by the user. Sandra_me30)

I am always willing to learn, so I will read carefully if you want to explain to me what is this "intellectual property" for which I buy a license of use under certain conditions (including what is revoked to me if I contravene to certain clauses of the contract, and I am working on it) and then my supplier decides that those conditions I had signed up (that and not others eh!) do not go well anymore and turn back to me two or three years after
As a concept of intellectual property, it seems to me an extensive so many, but they are still eye-catching to read clarifications that, I repeat, will be welcome.

Perhaps I will have a "Chinese" vision of the concept of intellectual property but I am a Chinese who, however, pays what is agreed, always and above all punctual, while in the face of subscription payments on the other side are definitely slower to fix bugs that, incidentally, have written them, not me...
I believe that the software houses the concept of intellectual property have completely overwhelmed them and if it goes on so we will come to kafkian levels so I will have to pay a tot per year for the books I possess as every time I reread them I use the work of someone else's intellect.

I think they are so convinced that they are living on the olympus that they really believe that they are allowed to be able, strong legal studies paid to carts of $, change the cards at the table at the start.
What I'm missing is this, from morning to night someone wakes up and decides to tartax who is out of service to make him pay anyway to every change of hardware a nice soup. where intellectual property is in all this continues to escape me and I also seem abused the noble sense that should be given to the term "intellectual"

the concept is: you want to sell me (as I think happens by catia) a cad, plm, cam or whatever you want, with the compulsory assistance otherwise the soft same is "spegne" ?, great, but you tell me premium!
Does that sound like "Chinese"?

 

[Er Presidente]

(Deleted the listed original post, as required by the user. Sandra_me30)

Sicilian is the right word with the dust!
:biggrin:

 

[Er Presidente]

........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................... premium!
Does that sound like "Chinese"?

It's useless that you get so hot!
the cad sell it to two users "type", the one that shoots and the "slide", what do you think you are? You know, with the hammer, you can handle it, but yours is a special case not worthy of mention.
:smile:
p.s.: I wonder only one thing, but the Chinese, the real ones, what do they do to them? do they offer the migration tool? Isn't it that they're spreading from us missing in the east?

 

[re_solidworks]

As far as I am concerned, I am convinced of the quality of siemens products, as positive opinions are read on this.
As for business choices at the management level, I must quote what is said by marcof and hunter.
I am also a small fish and I could not support a legal confrontation with a multinational of this kind and for this reason I would gladly give up work rather than have to buy a siemens product to carry out it. In essence until they reorganize the commercial summit with people more attentive to the needs of customers I avoid them, I think it is a protective attitude towards my company and that makes siemens my feedback for their decisions. If everyone did so the feedback would be so important to create an immediate change.
little or so we are all caught up in the neck by the software houses, but these tighten the knot at the edge of the strozzo.
in my home I do not tolerate arrogance and claim that any change to the contract signed is discussed and the opinion of the users (also through the dealers).
siemens is proving unable to dialogue with the little ones, something different than the dialogue with the big companies in which the commercial approach is "different".
in these cases the dealer can make the difference, what he said ozzy is true and I am pleased to have chosen his company for the ptc products, certainly in this period I would not be in the shoes of a siemens seller.
to today I have to thank a technician incapable (solidedge demonstration) thanks to which, in '99 we have definitely chosen swx!

 

[marcof]

(Deleted the listed original post, as required by the user. Sandra_me30)

Why do you think my is a controversy? I don't think it's polemic, just put yourself in the order of ideas that you can speak freely from different points of view.
here we are not at a corporate meeting in Japan where the toilet speaks after the assembly sang the company hymn. . .

(Deleted the listed original post, as required by the user. Sandra_me30)

@@ see, it is not at all difficult to explain as you say, if you want and if you press. the topic, at the end, is only the title of the thread and you know it very well; Just stay on the subject and you don't get distracted by some extra consideration that you call a bad boy you don't want.
If you do not want or cannot enter into certain discussions simply do not write to us without the need to give "Chinese" to your interlocutors.
writing is not like the pee that escapes and you can not hold it and also that, the pee, it is to say goodbye to it inside the pot, which otherwise touches "clean". . .

 

[bafio]

I read the thread a little fretfully and would like to summarize:

1) If you are not in assistance the license change costs you an eye (I have no words)
2) with the new anti-piracy system (after nx5) in siemens tell you that the hk are no longer supported (this was our experience) and you must compulsoryly (sig. ra moroni docet) switch to the cd and return to point 1
3) actually the cd is only mandatory for server licenses. if you have the locked node licenses as we can continue using the hk (thanks to Moorish Sea)
4) costs (time) for the license in use. because time is a cost. I requested a new file license (linked to the cd) due to change mother's card and the time between request, sending mudolo to fill out, return completed form and generation license was about 7 days. I have no words on this point, I can't accept it. blessed temporary licenses (which if you use them too much they also send you the gdf).
5) after I knew I could go back to the hk, I sent the form for the request, I sent it signed, I shipped within 5 working days (as specified in the module) to the good moraiscal ship and then I waited for the new hk. from 31/08/10 I am still waiting but I am confident that by Christmas they give me the gift.

 

[Achille Rosso]

I agree with you that it is not right that to send the new license code you have to pay something, but (I speak for my experience with solid edge) to start the new license file generation procedure you need to have an existing service contract.
the simplest way, in solid edge, is to be given once for all or the usb hardware key or the floating license with usb key (you pay once for all and you can re-install the software without problems. )
.... cut of the moderator
.... siemens plm does not forgive. Recently I know that they are doing a fierce anti-piracy campaign and have systems within the software that send their servers license file data in use.

 

[cacciatorino]

by definition a node locked license only works on the machine on which it is installed (key hw or not), and cannot be recalled by other users. If you can run a locked node license on multiple machines the cases are two (with if): you cloned the disk (it can be convenient but very suspicious), you started the sw with the inserted key, then you took it off and started on another car (still more suspicious).

with nx all this is not possible unless you resort to pirate licenses or escamotage however illegal. remember that illegality damages above all us users as unfair competition.

It's not about that. The typical case is:

1) are out of service
2) formatting the machine
3a) Do I have the hw key? I put it in the usb socket and restart
3b) Do I have a license linked to the hw? pago 1390 € and restart

I think what opinion I can have of siemens, they sold me a soft one with the hw key and then one day they came up to tell me that it was no longer needed and that the license instead of being tied to the key from that day was linked to the workstation. Who's been around the deal? Me or them?

illegality as siemens intends to dump pirates on legal clients, and I apologize if I allow myself but it's an absolutely anti-ethical way of working. I think it's just an extra way to pull up two money with the rectification of files, such as 1390 euros. but this argument exempts from the discussion.

 

[teo83]

Finally a resolution!!!

after so many attempts and many evenings throw away.

It's for me to say "thank you ip design... "

I can only confirm the good reputation of a person that you can definitely call a real friend. ... cut.

I hope the leaders who wanted to exploit our esteem to treat us as stupid, can read these words... .
and for them I say that the theoretical 1.400,00 € to them destined, more dirty than deceit than sweat will be used by me to implement my rescue hardware again avoiding similar discomfort and my need of their services... thank you for having me spend 20 days of hell...

I thank all those who participated in this discussion and specific that I, certainly no longer wanted to deal with a company ugs/siemens that treats me as "useless customer".

specific that my words are addressed to those in the high spheres of administration have the power to really do the interests of the honest customer.

information for who is in my own situation is that I am doing to analyze the contract to check if it really is possible to undergo this abuse.I will let you know about any positive feedback.

distinguished greetings

teo83